Please help translate moodle.com

Please help translate moodle.com

by Mary Cooch -
Number of replies: 21

Hello everyone

As part of our commitment to making quality online education accessible for all, the Marketing team would like to improve the quality of the German, Spanish, French, Italian and Portuguese translations currently on moodle.com. 

 We hope that some of you may be able to help  with this task and to make the process easier, we have set up a spreadsheet with links to a Google doc for key pages on our website. Each document includes the content of the website page in English with columns to enter the German, Spanish, French, Italian and Portuguese translations.

Here is the document: Translating moodle.com

 If you are able to help us, simply enter your translation and record your name in the relevant cells. 

 We really appreciate your contribution, however small or large!

In reply to Mary Cooch

Re: Please help translate moodle.com

by Luca Bösch -

Dear Mary

That's a very good initiative. 

Can a go further an make an additional, preliminary proposal (for laguages where it matters)?

Not only here, but also in moodle.academy courses we should choose how to address the reader. Do we write (fr) 'vous' or 'tu' ('Sie'/'du') ('Lei'/'tu')? And how to address women and men, and diverse? Do we write 'enseignant-e', 'Teilnehmer*in'?

I know of initiatives in germany thinking about tweaking e the language pack therefore (gender).

I think deliberation and decision (maybe language wise) is needed beforehand or it will be looking very chaotic and incoherent in the end and cause massive additional streamlining work.

Best,

Luca

In reply to Luca Bösch

Re: Please help translate moodle.com

by Mary Cooch -
Luca, you make a very good point there and let us make sure there is consistency.
In reply to Luca Bösch

Re: Please help translate moodle.com

by koen roggemans -
Picture of Language pack maintainers

A good suggestion Luca.

A translation memory (TM) would be good to have - for all translation work on Moodle by the way. It would make consistency a lot easier.

A short list of agreements per language could be a good step forward  (formal / informal / ... etc.). Would it be an idea to start a page in the docs for this? I can imagine that current language pack maintainers can easily come op with recommendations for their own language. Some of them are keeping an eye on that for over a decade - a lot of experience there. That way, the speak on Moodle pages have the most chance to be consistent with the Moodle software.

FYI In French a new child language pack is started: French inclusive / Français (écriture inclusive) to address the gender diversity issue.

Kind regards

Koen

In reply to Luca Bösch

Re: Please help translate moodle.com

by Ralf Hilgenstock -
Picture of Language pack maintainers

Hi

we have an ongoing discussion about formal language aspects in lang packages here in Germany and I think also in Switzerland and Austria.

From the very beginning we  translated the German package with both gender forms 'Trainer/in' for teacher that includes female and male form. Over the time Ralf Krause worked  in the package and replaced forms where a gender form is not required.  This form is conform with the official grammar rules for German. Moodle is used in schools and universities and should use the official grammar rules.

Its a very political and controversal discussion about the best way. Since some time Alex worked for a  client on a de_gender package that uses asterics 'Trainer*in'.  This form is not accepted from National institute for the German language but specially some universities are using this form. There is a critic that this form is not inclusive and accessible.

It also exists a language package that is using only the male form 'Trainer' and argues that this is the default version and includes male and female.  

An other question is the formal or informal 'you' (in German du/sie). What should we use on moodle.com. I think both is possible. 

In reply to Mary Cooch

Re: Please help translate moodle.com

by Ralf Hilgenstock -
Picture of Language pack maintainers
Hi Mary

what about the date information in the translaton files. Shall we ignore it, shall we replace it by the actual date or keep the date in the file?
Should we really add the name of translator in each line?
Ralf
In reply to Ralf Hilgenstock

Re: Please help translate moodle.com

by Mary Cooch -

Hello Ralf. I am passing on these messages from Abby and the Marketing team so I won't know all the answers. However I think the date information is for their internal use only,  not for translators. I assume they want translators to add their names to avoid any conflict if more than one translator works on the document at the same time?

In reply to Mary Cooch

Re: Please help translate moodle.com

by Daniel Neis Araujo -
Picture of Language pack maintainers
Hello, Mary

We at Adapta, as well as the whole brazilian community, are very interested in having moodle.com in Brazilian Portuguese.
Any chances we can have a /br or /pt_br there instead of using the /pt language?
We've been asking HQ about that for years and the translation costs and logistics were always the reason they didn't made it - albeit Brasil being the 5th country in registered Moodle sites with over 8.000 sites (which, by the way, the lastest news about Brasil on moodle.com mentioned only 4000) .

Do you think we can get this now as the translations will be provided by the community (and partners) for free?

Best,
Daniel
In reply to Mary Cooch

Re: Please help translate moodle.com

by German Valero -
Picture of Language pack maintainers
The Spanish language documentation in Moodle was written (many years ago) using the male, but the original documentation writers (from Spain) clearly stated:

"El uso habitual del género masculino en toda la documentación responde únicamente a criterios de simplicidad y fluidez en su escritura y lectura, y no a encubrir conceptos estereotipados en relación al género."

The commonly used male gender in all the documentation responds only to simplicity criteria and ease of writing and reading, and it is not a cover-up for gender stereotypes.

Many (but not all) academics at my university (UNAM) agree that we should follow long-standing Spanish language grammar rules, not current fashions (or fads).
In reply to Mary Cooch

Re: Please help translate moodle.com

by Abby Fry -

Hi Luca, Koen, Ralf, German and Daniel

Thanks very much for your input, suggestions and questions - and great to see that translations are already being inputted! 

A few easy ones -  yes ignore the date information, that is for internal use only.  And yes, each document includes columns for each language translation.  We've asked you to leave a name so that it helps avoid confusion if more than one translator works in one language.

I will revert to you next week re the suggestions for a short list of agreements = how to address the reader/formality and gender.

And Daniel, I'll come back to you regarding Brazilian Portuguese as soon as possible.

Regards

Abby Fry

In reply to Abby Fry

Re: Please help translate moodle.com

by Anderson Blaine -
Regarding the Portuguese language, there is an orthographic agreement in effect in countries like Brazil and Portugal, already applied in the basic education of their respective countries. So, I understand that the Portuguese language makes sense without referring to a specific country.

In everyday life, countries and even regions within the same country use different words to refer to the same thing. In this aspect, having child language for the Moodle LMS makes sense.

Regarding the main website (moodle.com), I see few terms that vary between countries, and if that happens, the conjunction "or" should be used. (Cookie or biscuit 🙃)

An important point is to make it clear what should not be translated, such as brand names like Moodle Workplace. This reminds me of a recurring debate about whether we should translate the names of plugins or not.


"MoodleAcademy" is a brand name, and I believe it should not be translated, including in the website menus.
In reply to Anderson Blaine

Re: Please help translate moodle.com

by Ralf Krause -
Picture of Language pack maintainers
Hi Mary,
sometime ago I asked for translation the moodle.com page to german language. And I asked for formal language (talking to people with "Sie") and informal language (talking to people with "du"). My own idea for a community driven learning management system is the informal language. You will find this idea also on the internet pages of big organisations. And with this idea in mind I translated the start pages of moodle.org.
Nest regards
Ralf

Ralf Krause
moodleSCHULE e.V.
In reply to Abby Fry

Re: Please help translate moodle.com

by Daniel Neis Araujo -
Picture of Language pack maintainers
Hello, Abby

Thank you!
I can see now we have PT-BR and do not have PT anymore.
For me it's awesome but I think that people from Portugal would not like as much as I do.
By the way, you just changed the URL/Slang and kept the same translation or this is already the brazilian translation?
I ask it because it looks better thant the version I remember of, but still has room for improvements.

Best,
Daniel
In reply to Daniel Neis Araujo

Re: Please help translate moodle.com

by Abby Fry -
Hi Daniel
Yes, it's already the Brazilian Portuguese translation, but this project will improve it again, so we'd appreciate your help with that!
Thanks
Abby
In reply to Mary Cooch

Re: Please help translate moodle.com

by Abby Fry -
Hi everyone

Thanks for your engagement, comments, and suggestions regarding translations on moodle.com.

We have now created a Style Guide for Translators which provides rules for translating Moodle product or service names, informal versus formal language, dialects, and SEO keywords. You’ll notice that we have provided some examples of the rules for particular languages and we'd appreciate your assistance in completing those examples. It'd also be helpful if you could suggest SEO keyword translations so that we maintain consistency across languages.

I also want to confirm that our automatic translation on the website is set to Brazilian Portuguese as it is one of Moodle’s largest audiences. Consequently, we'd like Brazilian Portuguese translations via this project. We are in the process of updating our slug to pt_BR on moodle.com.

Thanks again for your support with our Style Guide for Translators and our Website Translation project.

Regards
Abby Fry
In reply to Abby Fry

Re: Please help translate moodle.com

by Ralf Hilgenstock -
Picture of Language pack maintainers
Hi Abby,
thanks this is very helpfull. Can you exclude "Moodle Certified Partners or Service Providers" from the list of not translatable terms?

English: Moodle Certified Partners or Service Providers
German: Zertifizierte Moodle Partner oder Service Provider

This translation sounds much better in german.

Ralf
In reply to Ralf Hilgenstock

Re: Please help translate moodle.com

by Abby Fry -
Thanks Ralf
I have adjusted this in the document.
Regards

Abby Fry
In reply to Abby Fry

Re: Please help translate moodle.com

by Abby Fry -
Hi everyone

I'm letting you know that we'll update moodle.com with the translations we have been provided starting 2 August, so there's a little bit of time if you would like to contribute further to our translations!

Our European Spanish is complete, thanks 3ipunt!!. We have quite a lot of the German translations, and some Brazilian Portuguese - assistance with completing those and French and Italian translations would be appreciated.

Thank for your support
Abby Fry
In reply to Mary Cooch

Re: Please help translate moodle.com

by Ralf Hilgenstock -
Picture of Language pack maintainers
@German translators

Thanks for starting German translation. I've two notices:

Please use gender conform wording as we did in German language packs: Pädagog/innen, Trainer/innen, Systemadministrator/innen etc.
Please try to find translations that support the site intention. moodle.com is more an PR and ad site than a technical documentation. In some cases a word by word translation don't work in German.

Ralf
In reply to Ralf Hilgenstock

Re: Please help translate moodle.com

by Luca Bösch -

Hi Ralf

You mentioning "Pädagog/innen, Trainer/innen, Systemadministrator/innen" makes it seem like there's a consent over this.
Allow me to mention that also "Pädagog*innen, Trainer*innen, Systemadministrator*innen" is a possible choice.
I've known some institutions have taken it up in their regulations that gender conform wording is expressed through the asterisk notation.

So, is there already consent, if so, where has it been reached?
Or, if there isn't one, how to achieve consent?

Half of the strings using Trainer/innen and the other half using Trainer*innen doesn't look too good either…

Best,
Luca

In reply to Luca Bösch

Re: Please help translate moodle.com

by Ralf Hilgenstock -
Picture of Language pack maintainers
Hi Luca,
I'm aware of this discussion.
I think in official documents we should use the official rules for German grammar as defined by https://www.rechtschreibrat.com/geschlechtergerechte-schreibung-empfehlungen-vom-26-03-2021/ The Rat für deutsche Rechtschreibung defines the rules for all German speaking countries. If there any other decisions by some universities they can use it internally ansd also for their language packs. I think it would confuse teachers at schools expecting Moodle as a tool supporting official grammar when we use an other form on moodle.com. Same for public administration and corporates.

Ralf

Ralf